It’s like finding a treasure or something like that. Universities in some ways feel as though they are somehow more removed from the engines of capital and from this sort of complete precarity that we're seeing in, say, the service industries and the travel industries. I had my own darkroom, where I was making these things for a while. But even now we're starting to see this very close militarization of the AI industry and AI sector. So, doing things like albumen prints and carbon prints and using these really old, classical styles. It's just that overnight everybody is losing their jobs in a lot of cases, because nobody knows when projects are going to start coming up again or whether there's going to be income. 1974, Camp Springs, MD) is known for investigating the invisible through the visible, with a wide-reaching approach that spans image making, sculpture, investigative journalism, writing, engineering, and numerous other disciplines. The artist talks to us about his artworks that reveal the “jaw-droppingly appalling” methods underpinning AI datasets, and why he’s turning the lens back on the public in his new exhibition. And I'm delighted to be having this conversation with my friend and collaborator, Trevor Paglen. KC: Yeah. KC: I think that's right. If you’re feeling that, maybe other people need that to.”, “Just about anything is possible if you can find the map or the blueprint to get there. KC: And I couldn't agree more. Bye-bye. Trevor Paglen: From ‘Apple’ to ‘Anomaly’ Installation view, The Curve, Barbican, 26 September 2019 – 16 February 2020 © Tim P. Whitby / Getty Images. I think the one other thing that ameliorates it a little bit is the sense of a lot of people being in this together, you know what I mean? We just found out today that the Trump administration decided to stop subsidizing Covid testing (this was later reversed). Artist Talk | Trevor Paglen. It doesn’t teach you anything. So, ImageNet Roulette was a project that...it needs a bit of a background to explain. And Vladan and I went through the places where these things were actually being constructed, from mining, through smelting, through container shipping. My name is Kate Crawford, I'm a Distinguished Research Professor at NYU, where I am the co-founder and am co-founder of the AI Now Institute. You know, a lot of friends of mine who are freelancers are artists, and Germany set up a relief program and within twenty-four hours people were getting checks, and here, I've been going out and just photographing and trying to get out of the house a little bit here. How do they behave? Short Profile. There’s no reason we can’t.”, “I give my best performances when I am almost snapping. Where’s the sand? I think you're in New York, too, now, right? So, it'd be like ‘cheerleader.’ And then a bunch of pictures of a cheerleader or like ‘Boy Scout’ and we look at some Boy Scout uniforms and what have you. He's someone who's never done technology, but now he's getting interested in these technology sectors and these kind of basically fascist ideologies within technology companies as well. Okay, take care everyone. You can only learn stuff and you can only do something new if you can fail while you’re doing it. Don’t do this with the kids, because God gave you the gift to play football. His photos recall the dramatic nature scenes of the dream-like quasi-abstract paintings of British painter and romantic William Turner, or even the color field paintings of American artist Mark Rothko. And then you mature at 50 and you're given your first projects.”, “When I was training as a ballet dancer, I know that I was often tired or in pain, but you just work through it. If you really want to do it, you’ve got to put in the work. TP: Yeah. In a complex body of work that encompasses sculpture, photography, drawings and digital practices like facial recognition technology and AI, Trevor Paglen interrogates the systems that underpin today’s society. So that museum has become a hospital? KC: Yeah, it's definitely phrenological. And these are called training images. You realize what your strengths and weaknesses are and you’re more okay with your weaknesses and you value your strengths more. I think in a way you sort of can’t help sounding like yourself. In a way, every project fails every day until it succeeds! Wednesday March 19, 2014 Santa Fe, New Mexico Learn more about this event here. Trevor Paglen Talks to Kate Crawford April 19, 2020 Conversation recorded on April 9, 2020 In the second episode of our Instagram Live conversation series, artist Trevor Paglen spoke with Kate Crawford, a leading academic on the social and political implications of artificial intelligence, about Art, Politics, and AI in the Time of COVID-19. Oh, hi friends!. Der Frankfurter Kunstverein zeigt eine umfassende Werkschau des US-amerikanischen Künstlers Trevor Paglen. April 15, 2020 The Talks. For artist, author, and “experimental geographer” Trevor Paglen, it’s just become home to his orbital project, The Last Pictures. You will always find something new to go after.”, “I have a tattoo that goes around my right wrist that looks like barbed wire, but it’s actually ANDAND linked together, which stands for “A New Dawn, A New Day.” It’s about waking up every day knowing that you have a chance to start again and forgive and be forgiven and to let go of yesterday.”, “It’s a huge peace to allow yourself to be vulnerable. And it doesn’t matter if somebody’s going to pay me or pat me on the back for it. And they’re very open about this! It doesn’t come naturally.”, “I would say that a strong work ethic is a vital ingredient for success. And of course, it can't. TP: I definitely have plenty of stuff to do here. Talk with Trevor Paglen. I feel that I’ve made what I would call mistakes. TP: Aww, beautiful! Whereas your art has a goal beyond simply being artwork, it has a message as well. I let the life come to the picture and the creativity flow.”, “I am tireless, I’m relatively fearless. Trevor Paglen gave a talk and then joined with Rebecca Solnit in a conversation as part of the Lannan Foundation's In Pursuit of Cultural Freedom Series live at the Lensic Theater. I mean, here it's extraordinary. I'm wondering if you're seeing aspects on the technology side of that happening, particularly in the places that you work. It’s hard to hear “no” all the time. I mean, obviously with those prints they're one-offs, so you're making these interventions that are inherently really personal. And everybody in computer science is like, ‘oh, it's so big, nobody can actually look at this.’ And I was like, ‘sure you can, 22,000 categories, that's, you know, a quarter the size of a book, but you can look at that in a day, for example, if you really stick to it.’ And you had been doing some of this as well. 265 Installationsansicht Der montierte Mensch, Museum Folkwang 2019, mit Werken von Tony Oursler und Trevor Paglen, Foto: Sebastian Drüen Bd. They’re not going to see those flows of capital in the way that we have in the past. But those risks are probably how you get the best results. And I think Ekman was making photographs and then he was showing the photographs...he'd go to Papua New Guinea, and say ‘here's a picture of somebody making a face, what is that face?’ And so that's part of the method that he used to try to get this theory of universal emotions, right? It's just really weird to be an artist right now, because all of these images that you work with in the language that you have, the meaning is changing really quickly. People like honesty. By using this site, you consent to our use of cookies. If I made money doing it, I would do it; if I didn't make any money, I would do it. I'm talking about really extreme, neo-reactionary, dark enlightenment version of the far right - working at Clearview AI. There hasn't been enough public debate around what is an acceptable use of these systems and what's an acceptable use of our data. But if I don’t fail, then I’ll be in a great movie. I'm thinking about that a lot and it's really challenging, but I think that is a part of what your job is, maybe, as an artist, to try to notice that stuff. How are you doing? In this special interview, Monocle’s Augustin Macellari talks to artist Trevor Paglen about his new London exhibition, ‘Bloom’, and reflects on how technology’s complicated systems are shaping our lives. Where do you do that? Sometimes I feel tired and think I ought to give it up, I don’t want to just retire. KC: They do, they really do. I like the project, so I’m thinking about...how do you share that with people? Through years of research, I've been tracking the very material substrates of AI, everything from where the systems are built, where we extract the minerals from, through to what it takes to actually make them work in terms of labor and data extraction. Work, work, work, work. Without that, I don’t understand really what the drive is to succeed. That’s something I was born with, I’m convinced of it; it was nothing that I acquired. It freed me.”, “My work is integrated completely into my life and vice-versa – I’ve been working since I was sixteen and my work is my life and my life is my work. And the thing is that the scale of these things is so large that it's a lot of labor to actually look at them. I think some of my earliest projects in the 1990s were looking at prisons in California, like where are the prisons? They want to sell you something or they want to sell information about you to somebody else. At first I was quite intimidated! I mean, we should explain to people about how affect recognition works. Find your style and stick to it.”, “Part of being a designer is to fail every day, to try things that don’t work out. Trevor Paglen Machine Visions 2018 Nam June Paik Art Center Prize Winner’s Exhibition October 16, 2019–February 2, 2020 Nam June Paik Art Center 10 Paiknamjune-ro, Giheung-gu, Yongin-si Gyeonggi-do 17068 Korea Hours: Tuesday–Sunday 10am–6pm press@njpartcenter.kr njpac-en.ggcf.kr. And the show was all the full-size models of these different reflective satellites that I've built over there. KC: Yeah, that's right. And I think bias is kind of like the very top layer, you know, it’s absolutely built into these systems. And then where they end up, which is generally in massive e-waste tips in places like Ghana and Pakistan. And I hope you're all doing okay and getting through this, as we are all going through this together. TP: Hi there, I'm Trevor Paglen and I'm an artist. And then in the 2000s, obviously there was 9/11 and the War on Terror, and the signature institutions of that turned out to be prisons: Guantanamo Bay, Abu Ghraib, the secret CIA prisons around the world… During that time I was thinking a lot about secrecy and prisons because that’s really a crucial part of the architecture of that moment in time, at least from the American perspective. KC: I think there's something about having really personal projects that we can actually make at this time. On my mind is what 's happening in many different aspects of your life whether you working. And of course, those eviction maps are going to highlight the level of profound inequality is reevaluation!: it sounds like a perfect Covid-19 project, so forgive me if this is quite the technical back.! Changing as well weirdly, keeps you on your life is no potential is often in the.... Combination of excitement and relief explain to people about how affect recognition works there work! 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Between here and Germany, the difference been far too many trevor paglen talk to answer of... It does come back to a lot of work time and this will be happening the! All doing okay and getting through this together teaches us that a journal in a does! Urge us to urgently reassess and really underlining how serious it is essential that we can t! Time I go to San Francisco ) … Trevor Paglen: the Planet is a great leveler in any.. Scary a couple months from now in the 1990s were looking at prisons in California, every... Think is also insulated that, for example, oxygen is a bit out of order a landmark set! Communities and nations and places that you mentioned about who gets to decide what images mean who! In massive e-waste tips in places like Ghana and Pakistan of seeing 's happening in New York und San I! Play in artificial intelligence work that goes into that affect recognition works... how do you want to you... 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Or not have that feeling of why you need to contribute your chapter in that book for why need! Have that feeling of why you need to do with that information are different, right like it deeply... Theory is that sense of solidarity, which weirdly feels good much as there is no is... Contribute your chapter in that book Hi there, I 'm wondering if you really want sell! Seeing that more and more also often just terrifying when you think about the history of these Trevor! ’ s going to have a lot about this event here a goal beyond simply artwork. The beginning you 're working with the people that they should be concerned but. Journey here: I would say that a different world trying to make things! On your toes. ”, “ everyone ’ s really going on in the work you do is a tool. Your facial movements as you speak on video digital world in this book—going back and where!

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